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  • I would imagine a school has policies in place for this sort of thing, so i'd follow the policy guidelines.

    Spice (108) flagReport
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  • I would blacklist the device from the wireless connection, and keep their other activity under close observation. Let the Supt know what's going on and that you don't think much of it, but are doing the required due-diligence.

    then just leave it blacklisted... if you can't do that via the wireless system you can always make a DHCP reservation with bad settings or use the content filter to kill it as well.

    Spice (10) flagReport
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  • I would report it with HR and move on.  With it having anything to do with "teens" you want to make sure you atleast alert HR so they know about the issue just in case anything else would ever happen.  It's not IT's responsibility to confront the user with that.  I would also block the device from the WIFI network. 

    Spice (61) flagReport
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  • Follow your school's policy, it's not your job to have a word with them.

    In the UK our safeguarding policy says it's always better to report it and have the safeguard lead investigate then to leave it to chance, as for all you know it's not a one off other staff at the school may have reported a similar thing

    Spice (25) flagReport
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  • It's not up to IT, that should be brought to his manager and then HR for them to deal with. I would provide them with the details and then move on until you're needed again.

    Spice (15) flagReport
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  • This is definitely reportable.  It doesn't matter who it is or whether they connected from home and the phone reopened at the school.  If it is "teens" then it is child pornography, and that is a crime.  I think it's a felony, but I'm not sure, and it may even be Federal.

    You need to report this.  If it is ever discovered that you (you personally, the school, the principal, the superintendent, the board)  knew and didn't report it, you will all go down just the same as if you did it yourselves.

    Spice (9) flagReport
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  • Sal8273 wrote:

     If it is "teens" then it is child pornography, and that is a crime.  I think it's a felony, but I'm not sure, and it may even be Federal.

    I mean, i don't really watch porn anymore, but i can probably guarantee at least half of the porn on the planet has the word "teen" or "teens" in it. 18 and 19 is still a teenager, technically. So i'm not sure this route would be the proper route to go through.
    Spice (73) flagReport
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  • This is not your call. Follow procedure. Let HR talk it out with them.

    Spice (12) flagReport
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  • This is his personal device?  Then not much you can do, but know that your system blocked it.  You are allowing staff to use personal devices on the wifi.  Did they sign a usage agreement?

    I wouldn't worry about it, in fact I would be happy that it was blocked.  If the guy wants to surf porn at home, fine, but knowing he can't there would be good enough for me.

    We also allow people to put personal devices on our guest wifi, but they do sign a usage agreement.  Basically says we will remove their access for pretty much any reason.  That said, if I worried every time someone accidentally, or even purposely, hit a site they shouldn't then I would constantly be in HR's office reporting them.

    Don't worry about it, know it was blocked.  Keep an eye on it just to see if he is really trying to circumvent your monitor, or if it in fact was an oops on his part.

    Spice (23) flagReport
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  • I doubt that it's actually illegal material.  It's more the suggested type.  Either way, it's probably best to alert HR and/or his manager.  I'm going to hope that he simply forgot to log out from home, but really nothing surprises me anymore.

    Spice (3) flagReport
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  • Block the iPhone as a "security measure" pending guidance from HR and policy-making official(s) at your school.

    Proactive without judgement.

    If the staffer confronts you, simply state that you recently had to block "A" device from the network due to policy breach/accessing questionable content/potential security concerns. Then ask the staffer if they would like you to further investigate.

    Spice (14) flagReport
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  • Ross42. wrote:

    Sal8273 wrote:

     If it is "teens" then it is child pornography, and that is a crime.  I think it's a felony, but I'm not sure, and it may even be Federal.

    I mean, i don't really watch porn anymore, but i can probably guarantee at least half of the porn on the planet has the word "teen" or "teens" in it. 18 and 19 is still a teenager, technically. So i'm not sure this route would be the proper route to go through.


    Suuuure Ross. I believe you ;-).

    But yeah, seriously, if it's a legitimate, well known porn site, the chances of this being a crime are very slim. There's an entire "teen" section on most sites. Not that I uh... I mean I've only checked for research purposes, of course. I'm like Batman, you know? 

    Jim Gordon, talking about Batman:

    "There's a point, far out there when the structures fail you, and the rules aren't weapons anymore, they're... shackles letting the bad guy get ahead. One day... you may face such a moment of crisis. And in that moment, I hope you have a friend like I did, to plunge their hands into the filth so that you can keep yours clean!"

    Yep, that's me, the friend that plunges his hands into the filth so that you can keep yours clean. Just like Batman.

    Spice (42) flagReport
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  • You follow existing policy. Which likely states to contact the HR department for the school system. Being in IT you are not HR and are in a position to report infractions, not to act upon them. 

    It's not up to you to discuss the matter with the employee. This is where school policy and HR step in to address the matter.

    Spice (5) flagReport
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  • 1. Don't block anything. Don't change anything. Don't interfere with what may become a criminal or administrative investigation.

    2. You have a "filter" in place. By that fact, it's clear that you expected the filter to catch something. At that point, you should have had a response in place along with the filter. Something like, "Web access will be filtered to exclude xxxx. If access to xxxx is detected, the procedure is..." If not, now's the time to put one in place.

    3. Follow the procedure.

    This is a violation of an administrative policy. It should be handed off to administration. What would you do if you found a student doing the same thing? Do that.

    Spice (61) flagReport
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  • I would suspect that if any of this info was out in the public eye, and it was found nothing was reported, you would have some parents outside the school and your office with clubs and torches and pitchforks.  

    If you know and dont report, and it is found out.......  yer gonna have a bad time.....

    Spice (3) flagReport
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  • I see 2 problems here:

    1. The violation of the usage policy - whether inadvertent or not, it still happened.
    2. The specific type of content accessed.

    In our school district, the superintendent is supposed to be notified whenever a staff member is involved - especially educators.  If it ever came out in the future that something inappropriate took place by that person, you are subjecting the district to increased liability for not making a formal report.  If something ever happens with a student, you probably won't be able to sleep at night.

    Spice (8) flagReport
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  • REPORT. At the very least to administration. Because of the titles, you may have a Duty to Report to law enforcement.

    It does not matter that it's a personal device, or that it may have been a mistake like you said. You are in a K-12 environment and one of the staff's device tripped a filter to potentially child porn.

    If you don't go to LE, make sure you report in writing. This does have the potential to become a criminal case, and you want to have everything you did documented.

    Spice (6) flagReport
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  • Ross42. wrote:

    Sal8273 wrote:

     If it is "teens" then it is child pornography, and that is a crime.  I think it's a felony, but I'm not sure, and it may even be Federal.

    I mean, i don't really watch porn anymore, but i can probably guarantee at least half of the porn on the planet has the word "teen" or "teens" in it. 18 and 19 is still a teenager, technically. So i'm not sure this route would be the proper route to go through.
    True, Ross42., but perhaps I was stuck in K-12 mode and thinking 13-17, which is not legal.  If the teens are minors, this is reportable.  If they are over the age of 18, then it is not reportable.   End of that discussion.  And even if the teens are 18 and 19 (and legal) this should be reportable up the food chain, although I would not argue with a person who suggests the iPhone owner gets a talking to first.
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  • Furthermore, if someone else alerts the principal and administration and then they find out you didn't, you will likely be in serious trouble at that point - possibly even accused of collusion.

    Spice (2) flagReport
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  • Sal8273 wrote:

    If the teens are minors, this is reportable.  If they are over the age of 18, then it is not reportable.

    Everything is reportable.  If the exact age is in question, law enforcement has a method they use for determining the likelihood of the person being under age.  The problem comes with the "prosecution" side - not with the "arrest" side.
    Spice (1) flagReport
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  • Sal8273 wrote:

    True, Ross42., but perhaps I was stuck in K-12 mode and thinking 13-17, which is not legal.  If the teens are minors, this is reportable.  If they are over the age of 18, then it is not reportable.   End of that discussion.  And even if the teens are 18 and 19 (and legal) this should be reportable up the food chain, although I would not argue with a person who suggests the iPhone owner gets a talking to first.
    It's reportable. It's not up to IT to determine the age of the actors. It's a K-12 environment, there's "teens" in the title. Schools have a much different duty of care than corporate.
    Spice (4) flagReport
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  • There should be an end user agreement and acceptable use policy in place.  You need to proceed according to those policies and also it depends on if the phone is personal or school property.  If the phone is issued by the school you can confiscate it if the policy indicates, if its personal you will need to collect evidence that porn was accessed  through the school infrastructure.

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  • TrechTrainer, actually you don't. It does not matter who owns the phone, or even if the material was accessed using school resources. You have evidence that a staff at a K-12 accessed what may be child porn. Period. Full stop.

    I have a son who is a teacher. The duty of care for teachers is very high. The least the OP needs to do is forward all logs and evidence, in writing, to the Principal. I would also check local laws and school board policies. In some jurisdiction, there is no choice but to report child porn to the authorities.

    Spice (5) flagReport
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  • Every time one of these questions comes up, I ask myself these questions:

    1. Does the activity violate policy? If so, report it to HR and provide them with any "evidence" you may have come across. Let HR handle it from there.

    2 No policy? Report any activity which could cause the company harm, (reputation, legal, financial, etc.) and suggest that an appropriate policy be implemented, explaining why that activity poses a threat if necessary. Your company relies on you to be the expert when it comes to technological threats, so speak up!

    3. No HR department? Report the activity to your supervisor, or to whomever would be appropriate at your company.

    An IT department isn't the morality police, but we are responsible for protecting our employer from electronic threats. If there is a policy for acceptable use, follow it. If there isn't a policy, you should suggest they implement one. Under no circumstances should IT try to make decisions about what is morally acceptable within an organization; that decision needs to be made by HR, or other senior management. Period.

    Spice (6) flagReport
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  • Jim Schuuz wrote:

    Sal8273 wrote:

    If the teens are minors, this is reportable.  If they are over the age of 18, then it is not reportable.

    Everything is reportable.  If the exact age is in question, law enforcement has a method they use for determining the likelihood of the person being under age.  The problem comes with the "prosecution" side - not with the "arrest" side.
    Perhaps I should have worded this differently?  What I meant was, if they are over the age of 18 then you are not required to report it to any agencies dealing with child porn.  Actually, as I am writing this response, I am thinking it would need to be reportable in any case because the students in a K-12 setting are all minors, and the iPhone owner is in a position to expose them to unsavory web content.  Thanks for pointing that out, Jim Schuuz


    Serge7400 wrote:

    Sal8273 wrote:

    True, Ross42., but perhaps I was stuck in K-12 mode and thinking 13-17, which is not legal.  If the teens are minors, this is reportable.  If they are over the age of 18, then it is not reportable.   End of that discussion.  And even if the teens are 18 and 19 (and legal) this should be reportable up the food chain, although I would not argue with a person who suggests the iPhone owner gets a talking to first.
    It's reportable. It's not up to IT to determine the age of the actors. It's a K-12 environment, there's "teens" in the title. Schools have a much different duty of care than corporate.
    Yep, it is.  For some reason I was stuck on the content and forgot about the environment.  Not enough coffee today, methinks.
    Spice (4) flagReport
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  • This may be awkward, but it's straightforward.  The filter was in place for a reason.  Now that it's caught something, your job is to report it to HR along with whatever evidence you have.  It's HR's job to deal with the employee.  If HR wants you to shut off access, check their other devices for more evidence, or take some other action, they will tell you.  That's not your call to make, unless you have a specific policy that says otherwise.

    I've dealt with a number of these situations myself in the past.  One user was downloading porn.  Another was using torrents to download movies illegally (we got a DMCA takedown notice through our ISP on that one).  Another user reported a company laptop as stolen, but telemetry from the laptop indicated it was still being used at the employee's house.  None of these situations was particularly fun, but in every case I told HR very clearly what I knew, and what I didn't know.  HR took it from there. 

    Spice (1) flagReport
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  • Investigation of a personal mobile device can be enforced with a search warrant.  There would also likely be union involvement.

    With that said, regardless of the title or specific nature of the content, you report this incident to your direct supervisor (I recall you said you're the tech director, so I'm guessing you report to an assistant super or the super him/herself?).  There are several dangers that have nothing to do with whether the content itself is legal or illegal.

    In an increasingly BYOD environment, if that staff member -- assuming a teacher -- connected the device to a projector and that was the first thing that appeared, then the local news channel vans are going to be hovering outside the building within hours.

    To those rationalizing the apparent ages of performers and nature of content, all of that is irrelevant.  There are several laws and regulations that strictly govern how schools must operate with regard to Internet usage and safety of children on-line that do not apply to private sector.  It doesn't matter what you believe to be appropriate or inappropriate content.  It matters what state and federal guidelines, like CIPA, require.

    Spice (3) flagReport
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  • Very cut-and-dried. Look in your accepted use policy and do what it says. Report if you ought to, blacklist the device if you ought to, literally just do whatever you do when this sort of thing occurs. I'm hoping you do have some kind of procedure in place; you have procedures for restoring from backups, right? In case something goes south? Well, you probably have a procedure for what to do about dirty website access from within the school. It may have been a while since you had to use it, but just find it, dig it out, and follow the steps.

    If you don't, well, I'd report it up the food chain (whoever that might be). And take this opportunity to write a procedure on it for next time. Because assuming the school stays around for a bit, there will be a next time, it's just a matter of when exactly.

    Spice (1) flagReport
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  • Chad1642 wrote:

    ...would report it with HR and move on....

    Straightforward, and best to keep it that way.
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  • Thank you all for the advice.  I have reported this to the proper supervisors.  Thanks again for being a great community.

    Spice (10) flagReport
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  • The policy at the school I work at is when I get a alert that a teacher has looked up something that they should not I go down there when they do not have students in there classroom and show them the report. If its there personal device I give them a warning and tell them if it happens I will have to take the next report to there building principal. So far there has never been a 2nd time. If they looked up things they should not on there school computer. The building principal and I go get the teacher and then take action from there.
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  • Randon6250 wrote:

    The content of the video contains "teens caught by parents" pornography.

    The adult industry goes to great lengths (sic) to ensure their talent is of legal age. If the site in question is one of the big ones (X Hamster, Porn Hub, Brazzers, et al.), the odds of the talent being anything under 21 is pretty damn small and under 18 is exactly zero.

    That said: Human sexuality is complicated. Just because someone likes some variation of "teen" porn doesn't necessarily mean they want to have sex with teens. Leave the kink out of it and address the facts of the violation.
    Spice (11) flagReport
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  • Randon6250 wrote:

    We are thinking that this may have been accessed at home first then forgot to possibly close out and the phone auto connected to our network thus causing the filter trip.  What would you all do? 

    If your network filter caught and prevented the content from displaying, and your logs can support the idea that this was an honest mistake and not an attempt to browse porn at work, why is this even a problem? Content blocked. No porn was accessed. 

    However, IT needs to comply with the administration's policies in this. It's not up to you to decide what gets reported and what doesn't. (Unless, of course, it is up to you.) If the policy mandates all access attempts are reported to school administrators and investigated, that's what you do. If the policy doesn't specify, and the log data supports the premise that it was an honest mistake caused by an open browser connection and a phone auto-connecting to the school's WiFi, I'd provide the data & your professional opinion to your department supervisor and let them decide whether and how to bring it up with the user. 

    Speaking as an IT professional who's dealt with similar situations in the past and in the absence of policies governing how to proceed, I'd approach the user after school and off school grounds (or at least in the parking lot) and say something like, "Heya - a quick reminder that all network traffic on the staff WiFi is logged. If your phone connects automatically, it's a good idea to make sure you've properly exited whatever apps you use at home before you come to work."

    Pause for a moment while giving them a meaningful look. 

    "Have a great night!"

    They'll probably get the hint. 
    Spice (16) flagReport
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  • Just report it and move on with your day.  It doesn't matter what the content is/was.  If their device attempted to access blocked content on your network then you follow district policy (which is probably to report it to the building principal and/or other supervisors.  If those handling the situation require further information then you provided it to them but otherwise I wouldn't put yourself in a bad spot by "voluntarily" investigating further.

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  • I use to work for a school district and I agree it's not for IT to confront the user. Notify HR and again, block the device. On the other hand, if the staff member can access Porn from the wireless AP, can the students?? And why is it not "blocked" ?? Why would a staff  member need to access something like that at school? I don't see one at all. That should be blocked from the very beginning, along with dating sites, etc. Just my two cents worth....

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  • All this talk leaves me with one question:  Who watches porn on a phone?  I seriously cannot believe people do this..

    Spice (1) flagReport
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  • tfl wrote:

    tfl wrote:

    To a degree it depends on who you are and where you are.
    It I read it right, you are experiencing potential kiddy porn. In most jurisdictions, that's illegal. For an educational institute, staff involved with Kiddy porn probably HAS to be reported.
    If you were compassionate, you might tell the person what has happened and that he (presumably a he) is on  final warning - any repeats will be sent to law enforcement. On the other hand, if it were a Donald Trump type character, just report him and let the chips fall where they may.
    And before you do anything, you might consider taking advice!
     
    Oh, so you're tolerant of letting someone with kiddie porn off unless it's a Trump supporter?  You must work for Podesta the molesta.  Disgusting.
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  • It's your job to report something like this to the properly people.  Be it HR or the Principle of the school.  

    Continue to monitor it a little more closely to ensure it's not a trend this staff member to starting to do.  If it's something that is going on at the house and the staff "forgot" to close the browser, it's something that occurred on school properly.

    Be glad that the filter is working as it should and stopped the content from being viewed and alerting you.

    Is it an uncomfortable situation to be in to report someone yes.  Have I had to do this at my current work place?  Yes and we are not a school.  The person here was questioned and educated on proper work behaviour.  To the best of my knowledge other them maybe 4 of us at work, no one else knew this occurred and it hasn't occurred again.

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  • How about if this is a pop-up on his phone?

     I know I can barley surf websites on my Android without being inundated with pop-up ads I have to scroll past, popup ads that take over until I X out of them, pop-ups that open new tabs and so on... I think surfing the web from a smartphone has become unbearable... 

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  • Bryce Katz wrote:

    If your network filter caught and prevented the content from displaying, and your logs can support the idea that this was an honest mistake and not an attempt to browse porn at work, why is this even a problem? Content blocked. No porn was accessed. 
     

    It could be.  I have an "honest mistake" story from a long time ago.  We used to have a Mac cube out in the IT helpdesk area to use as a kiosk station.  One of the IT guys needed a socket wrench that we didn't have and thought he'd use the Mac to shop for it.  Snap-On Tools was the intended site/  However, he mistyped the URL and found a site with different tools....  Since every window he closed opened 3 or 4 more, he asked me what to do since he was "Mac-stupid".  Being Mac-stupid myself, the two of us ended up unplugging the Mac and then plugging it back in.  Definitely not the site he was looking for, and it was, indeed, an accident, so it might possibly be an accident in this case.  Might be.  Might not be.  But while we can prove the user did access a particular site, it is more difficult to prove it was an accident.  Fortunately, this is not a job for IT.
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  • You have a staff member in a K-12 environment looking at teens having sex and getting caught by adults. I imagine that the adults then join the festivities. That's a fantasy that is a bit alarming given your environment. Run, don't walk, to HR, and show them what you have.

    I got a middle school teacher arrested, tried, convicted, and banned from ever working in a school again, and I did it with the filter logs. He was into prepubescent girls, and he had a job in a building full of them. It was a nice catch.

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  • For sure follow any policies set in place Being it is a school and its teen content I would have it investigated to the max.

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  • Bryce Katz wrote:

    If your network filter caught and prevented the content from displaying, and your logs can support the idea that this was an honest mistake and not an attempt to browse porn at work, why is this even a problem? Content blocked. No porn was accessed. 

    Because K-12

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  • Like many have said.....just the word "teen" does not always mean illegal.  Ive seen videos of 30 year old women with their hair in ponytails, and knee high socks pretending to be teen, but teen is way way back in their rear view mirror.  Viewing pornography of children, or teens below the age of 18 is illegal, but technically, you dont know for sure if he/she was viewing illegal porn.

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  • Whether corporate or school, this will need to be reported.

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  • Ross42. wrote:

    Sal8273 wrote:

     If it is "teens" then it is child pornography, and that is a crime.  I think it's a felony, but I'm not sure, and it may even be Federal.

    I mean, i don't really watch porn anymore, but i can probably guarantee at least half of the porn on the planet has the word "teen" or "teens" in it. 18 and 19 is still a teenager, technically. So i'm not sure this route would be the proper route to go through.
    It probably does not matter whether YOU are "not sure this route would be the proper route to go through."  It matters WHERE this is taking place, inside a school, and in what location (State, Country, etc.) as to what the law says.

    In California, I'm pretty sure that there is a LEGAL requirement for all education-related employees to report such events/situations.   It's not YOUR call whether it's proper, or not.   That's above your "pay grade" in these situations, you report to someone and let THEM make the decision.  That's basic CYA.  You make it the problem of the person receiving the report(s).  If "something" happens, it seems unlikely that you would be names as an accomplice, but you would probably get clobbered as having failed to report according to your legally mandated duty.

    I'd hate to have to find out what the penalties would be, as it is likely to involve substantial sums of money, lawyers, and potentially losing your job, if not your career.

    That's my 2-cents, anyway.

    VM

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  • As former school district IT staff I can commiserate that this is all too common, especially if you have even a partially  BYOD environment. Shockingly, school district employees are far too comfortable even with equipment they are issued. The best thing you can do to protect yourself and the district is to go up the ladder with this discovery in the event that such an individual becomes involved in some type of related litigation. In that case, investigators will be on the scene with subpoenas demanding logs, backups, etc anyway due to the nature of the accused's employment at a school. They will also demand any equipment regularly used by or issued to the individual. And yes, they will want to know who was notified of filtering violations and to what level that information was escalated to administrators. Unfortunately, I speak from experience on this.

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  • joebob wrote:

    Ross42. wrote:

    Sal8273 wrote:

     If it is "teens" then it is child pornography, and that is a crime.  I think it's a felony, but I'm not sure, and it may even be Federal.

    I mean, i don't really watch porn anymore, but i can probably guarantee at least half of the porn on the planet has the word "teen" or "teens" in it. 18 and 19 is still a teenager, technically. So i'm not sure this route would be the proper route to go through.


    Suuuure Ross. I believe you ;-).

    But yeah, seriously, if it's a legitimate, well known porn site, the chances of this being a crime are very slim. There's an entire "teen" section on most sites. Not that I uh... I mean I've only checked for research purposes, of course. I'm like Batman, you know? 

    Jim Gordon, talking about Batman:

    "There's a point, far out there when the structures fail you, and the rules aren't weapons anymore, they're... shackles letting the bad guy get ahead. One day... you may face such a moment of crisis. And in that moment, I hope you have a friend like I did, to plunge their hands into the filth so that you can keep yours clean!"

    Yep, that's me, the friend that plunges his hands into the filth so that you can keep yours clean. Just like Batman.

    You are a hero to the Spiceworks community.  Thank you for your service.

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    I use BitWarden for my own personal password management and it's fantastic. In the past, I've used a handful of different password managers in the workplace, including KeePass v2​, Secret Server​, LastPass​, and even just *cough* Excel.... 🥸Currently, we'...

  • Upgrade Exchange 2013 to Exchange 2019

    Upgrade Exchange 2013 to Exchange 2019

    Collaboration

    As the  Exchange 2013 is going to be end of life in April 2023, we will be upgrading / migrating our current setup to Exchange 2019.We are currently using MS Exchange 2013 Standard CU23 with Latest SU. We have 2 CAS servers in NLB and 4 Mailbox servers in...

  • Spark! Pro series - 6th October 2022

    Spark! Pro series - 6th October 2022

    Spiceworks Originals

    Today in History: 1866 -  The Reno brothers carry out the first train robbery in U.S. history On October 6, 1866, the brothers John and Simeon Reno stage the first train robbery in American history, making off with $13,000 from an Ohio and Mississ...

  • IT Site -Network Survey Tools

    IT Site -Network Survey Tools

    Software

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